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Morning Joe

News/Business. Interviews with newsmakers and politicians; host Joe Scarborough. New.

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Us 29, New York 22, New Jersey 17, Sandy 15, Romney 13, Obama 12, Fema 10, Nbc 10, Staten Island 9, Christie 9, Washington 8, America 8, Pennsylvania 8, Willie 7, Virginia 7, Ohio 7, Iowa 7, Colorado 7, Florida 7, Brian Sullivan 6,
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  MSNBC    Morning Joe    News/Business. Interviews with newsmakers  
   and politicians; host Joe Scarborough. New.  

    November 2, 2012
    3:00 - 6:00am PDT  

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time for one quick e-mail. what do we got? >> we have this in new york. please, everyone, join me in a campaign to elect to elect president willie on tuesday. >> first of all, your name's not biff. i wish you'd write under your real name. this does remind us about bronco bamma from abigail in ft. collins, colorado. take it away. >> i'm tired -- i'm tired of bronco bamma and mitt romney. >> that's why you're crying? oh, it will be over soon, abby. okay? the election will be over soon, okay? >> okay. >> oh. i tell you what, you know, my mom, christie, used to have an expression. joey, if there's something bad, something goodwill come. and i want to tell you what
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makes me so proud. in moments of crisis, democrats and republicans always came together. i've got to tell you, it was reassuring to be on those calls. i really mean this. it was reassuring. that's how it's supposed to work. we always work better in america when we work together and everyone's in on the deal. and i tell you -- >> that's one way to look at it. good morning. it's friday, november 2nd. welcome to "morning joe." it's been a long week. with us on set, msnbc and "time" magazine senior political analyst, mark halperin. national affairs editor for "new york" magazine and msnbc political analyst, john heilemann and pulitzer prize-winning historian, jon meacham. good to have you on the show this morning. we will talk politics soon. >> thank you, ma'am. >> actually, the candidates are jumping back into the fray. full campaign mode again. and we have an endorsement by mayor michael bloomberg to talk about. >> is that what that was?
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>> the word disappointing and endorsement. >> let's just leave it there. >> passive aggressive endorsement. >> it was. it was passive aggressive. we also have, later in the show, the jobs numbers coming up. and i do think that will be interesting metric. >> are we going to -- i wondered if we're going to allow these two wardrobe decisions to go unnoticed. the three-piece. who's it homage to? >> deutsche. >> donny. >> and bob novak. >> straight from the program to the campaign trail. >> this is your campaign gear? >> garb. >> inside pockets. >> he's not wearing sweats, though. >> is it a fleece sweater or a sweater sweater? >> you guys obviously are in the part of the city without power. no problem. >> got dressed in the dark. >> we'll start with the weather. the stories of hardship and misery continue to emerge. and this morning we are four days away from the presidential election and four days removed from hurricane sandy, one of the
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worst storms ever to hit this country. the death toll now stands at 94. there are still 4.6 million homes and businesses without power. and the new estimate for economic damage to say nothing of all the property damage is $50 billion. "the new york times" reporting the storm could shave half a percentage point off the country's gdp. for most of the northeast, it's now a recovery mission. and yesterday california military planes were loaded with utility vehicles ready to be shipped into new york. an army of some 50,000 utility workers from across the country, even canada, being deployed to the region to help in the massive project to restore power which will take weeks. three navy warships are anchored off the northeast coast to help with the relief effort. in new jersey, military trucks are being deployed to operate as polling places on election day in the hardest-hit communities still remain without power. now, the good news does trickle
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out slowly. today amtrak will begin offering limited service between new york city and boston. and new jersey transit will also start moving today with limited service. the new york subway system continues to make advances. the "m" train linking queens to manhattan just started running, but there are still no trains running below 34th street where half of manhattan remains in the dark. so the millions of new yorkers who depend on subways, they're now waiting in those long lines for buses. for those who drive into new york city, the lines at city bridges stretched for miles yesterday, enough to make you turn around and just stay home. it's simply not worth it. it will take all day to get in in some cases. in an effort to ease gridlock inside the city, the mayor has ordered all vehicles entering manhattan to have at least three passengers for the rest of the week. there are checkpoints set up on the way into manhattan with cars not meeting the three-person rule, those cars turned away.
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and you're only beginning to make your way into new york if you're lucky enough to find gas for your cars. about 80% of new jersey stations are either without power or without fuel. those that do have gas are facing nearly impossible demand. both new jersey senators are now asking president obama for emergency fuel supplies. we saw that throughout the city this morning. the cabbies trying to get to work. they're getting gas at their substations that sometimes they own privately, but at some point those are going to run out. there is just no gas. no one can get gas for their cars. >> amazing scenes, too, jon meacham of new yorkers, people in new jersey, connecticut, up and down the coast looking for basic human needs. talking about trying to find food. even as close as staten island, food, gas. this is a crisis that seems to be deepening in many ways. >> you know, it reminded me watching the damages of how we talked about how we were going to be prepared for any
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eventuality after september 11th in the drama and the trauma of that moment. and yet how, you know, we're so beyond first world in so many ways. i'm not sure what we should call it, that we tend to end up flailing a bit, almost disproportionately. >> there were cities and towns that weren't infrastructurally prepared at all. and people who didn't heed evacuation orders, and now they are in a worse situation than they could ever have imagined in their lifetimes. the secretary of homeland security, janet napolitano, and fema's deputy administrator scheduled to arrive in staten island. the new york city borough where 19 people died because of the storm. many residents there are feeling desperate. they're feeling overlooked, and they're getting angry, saying they've received little emergency aid. nbc's ann curry spent the day there yesterday. >> every single person on this
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block lost everything. >> reporter: staten island has had enough. >> we just want everyone to know that we are hurting down here, and we need help immediately. >> reporter: residents here are asking why hasn't more help arrived? >> i think that we're not getting the attention because we are, you know, a working-class neighborhood and kind of just like fend for yourself kind of thing. >> reporter: on the debris-strewn streets of this community where the death toll has risen to at least 19, fury and frustration played out on live television. >> but you need to come here and help us. we need assistance, please. >> reporter: staten island's borough president calls it an absolute disgrace. >> the red cross, it's nowhere to be found. all the american red cross, all these people making these big salaries, these big salaries should be out there on the front lines. and i am disappointed. >> reporter: the red cross says it's sending ten vehicles with food and water. meantime, residents and officials are questioning the city's priorities. >> the city of new york right
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now is talking about getting water out of the battery tunnel and preparing for a marathon. we're pulling bodies out of water. you see the disconnect here? >> reporter: today new york city police and fire departments were still going house to house to account for everyone who didn't follow the mandatory evacuation order. can you look me straight in the eye and say that a response was not disproportionate for places that were more wealthy in new york city? >> absolutely not. we brought everybody in. there's fema task forces that have been assigned here now and assisting us with the searches. >> we are in the community talking to the residents. it's been effective. and we're urging everybody to register with fema. >> i never planned to leave here. i thought i would stay here the rest of my life. >> reporter: she didn't lose members of her family, but she did lose virtually everything else. >> i want to go home, but there's no home! i can't go home! and that's killing me. it's breaking my heart. i want to go home to my house.
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>> reporter: at 62 and a grandmother, she is trying to find traces of her life. >> this is the only wedding photograph of my mom. >> reporter: a moment of joy as the water on staten island recedes amid widespread desperation and grief. >> incredible stories still unfolding right now. this is what bill karins is talking about yesterday after the sort of novelty of the first couple of days and everyone coming together wears off, the people who are hurting, it's raw. and it's going to be a long time for them. >> i also think, john heilemann, a lot of cases, some of these are areas were evacuation zones, there's some crying of wolf and people saying this is my home, i don't have anywhere else to go, i'm going to stay put. in 19 cases it cost people their lives. >> you remember this back with katrina, the same thing happened where a lot of residents in new orleans had seen a lot of hurricanes before. and they heard this is going to
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be the storm of century, and nothing ever happened to their houses, and they ignored evacuation orders. you can't -- there's only so much preparation you can do. you can never create a risk-free society. you can't prepare for everything. you know, but one of the things that has to happen in these situations for things to work right is for the government has a part to play, but individuals have a part to play, too. you've got to be working together so when people -- some of these people, obviously, their pain is genuine and totally understandable. but some of these people did, you know, were told to leave and didn't leave. and you understand why they didn't. it makes sense in human terms, but, you know, there is a responsibility that you have for yourself in addition to what the government obviously has for you. and again, if both sides are woaren't working together, that's when things fall apart. >> the person talking about
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they're pulling bodies out of water, the economy has to keep going, and there is potentially, meacham, some sort of symbolism as well. they're grappling with that in other towns and communities up and down the east coast are probably dealing with similar types of decisions as they try and move on. >> it's phenomenally complicated. >> really complicated. >> at what point do you show you're strong, restill yebzisil. >> no better way. >> the debate about what should be done after the attacks 11 years ago. it was the same kind of tension. and i'm not sure what i would do. i'm glad it wasn't my decision. i understand folks who feel this way. >> the marathon is an extraordinary amount of resources. and i think they really need to make sure, particularly staten island, they're doing everything they can for those people before they have this big display over the weekend of law enforcement and all sorts of resources to put this thing on. >> if there was a symbolic action, there's a huge amount of
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corporate money that goes into the sponsorship of the marathon. if they were to cancel the marathon and all the corporations that put that money in were to say we're giving this money to disaster relief. >> i love it. >> we're all going to pull together in a symbolic way, make a different kind of symbolic statement, the resilience of the marathon towards aid and relief. >> how about the corporations doubling down? >> fine. >> and throwing a whole lot more money into it for disaster relief. >> great. >> making the marathon everything about rebuilding. and by the way, showing that corporations can be incredible parts of community and to work with, you know, alongside the government in helping build this country, it would be an opportunity. >> they are people. >> and it is a marathon. and as a rebuilding effort, there's got to be a marathon, it could be a nice symbolic gesture. >> the dad was asking me last night, saying where are those guys who make the big bonuses in the big companies, where is the moral component here? where are they? where are people stepping up? it doesn't feel like you've seen that. >> they are. i think they are privately.
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>> i mean, there's the red cross and people giving to the red cross. >> yeah. a lot of those firms are giving money. and i think -- >> we have our benefit. >> for the marathon, i think they will give a lot of that money away, the tv rights and all that, they're going to give a lot of that for charity. if you stop for a minute and try to imagine the visual of a pack of people jogging through these scenes in staten island or lower manhattan, it's going to be very difficult. >> all these cops and rescue people, you know, there's just a lot of public infrastructure and resources that get diverted to making that route work. it just seems of secondary importance relative to all of the suffering that's happening in the city. >> who knows? >> you also realize, again, just how important great political leadership can be right now. whatever you think about the national implications and all that, what governor christie has gone, what mayor giuliani did, what did not happen in katrina makes such a huge difference to have someone who feels as though -- you feel they're actually in charge. >> by the way, tonight at 8:00,
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we put this together very quickly. it will be on nbc 8:00, a benefit to raise a bunch of money for the people who need help. bruce springsteen, billy joel, bon jovi, the biggest stars to come out of new jersey and new york, all the money's going to go to the american red cross. matt lauer hosts. brian williams will be there, jimmy fallon will be there, i think sting. so it's going to be a big collection. christina aguilera as well, 8:00 tonight on nbc. >> wonderful. let's swing to presidential elections now. with just four days to go, president obama is focusing on, where else? where do you think he went? ohio. he's making stops there every day between now and tuesday. he'll also be in virginia, florida, new hampshire, iowa, colorado and wisconsin over the next 96 hours. mitt romney will be in many of those same states over the next four days, although he's hitting pennsylvania and skipping florida. president obama was back on the trail yesterday after a three-day break to oversee the storm recovery. rallying to a crowd of 10,000 in
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colorado. the president made what some are saying was a jab at his opponent's tendency to change his mind. >> after four years as president, you know me by now. you know me. you may not agree with every decision that i've made. you may be frustrated at the pace of change. i always remind people that when we did the auto bailout, only 10% of the country approved of it. including, by the way, folks in michigan and ohio. but you know what i believe. you know where i stand. you know i'm willing to make tough decisions even when they're not politically convenient. >> mitt romney also returned to pre-hurricane attack mode yesterday. at a rally in virginia, romney blasted the president for suggesting in his interview earlier this week with joe and me that he'd consider creating a new secretary of business in a second term.
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>> i've said that i want to consolidate a whole bunch of government agencies. we should have one secretary of business instead of nine different departments that are dealing with things like giving loans to sba or helping companies with exports. there should be a one-stop shop. >> they came up with something this last week, though, the president said he's going to consider putting in place a secretary of business, all right? a department of business. well, first, of course, we already have a department of commerce. and commerce and business do mean the same thing, after all. but i don't happen to think that putting in a new chair in the cabinet room is going to bring new jobs to the people of america. so we've got a plan instead to do that. >> mark halperin, let's look at some of the geography here over the last four days. this is president obama's campaign schedule. if you can follow those arrows. you don't really need to. just look at the states. what does it tell us?
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>> well, one thing i like to declare a moratorium on -- >> i'm confused by this graphic. is that the hurricane? >> it's pretty looking. >> that's how grant invaded ohio. >> i see. >> the candidate goes -- it shows they're panicked about that state. they've got to go someplace. they go some places where they're doing well. i mean, it's still about ohio. the winner of ohio is almost certainly going to win this election. you'll see more time in ohio than anywhere else. the president is going to be in ohio today. some virginia, some iowa. the weakness is in wisconsin, a state they were not necessarily counting on having to defend, but you can't just camp out in one place. we've had a playing field of seven to nine states. now maybe ten because you're seeing some republican action in pennsylvania. this is about ohio. and that's the focus as much as anywhere else for both of them.
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>> but you can see him, you know, we're both intellectually involved in the last few days in where we're going to be. the president's spending a lot of time not just in ohio but also in these firewall states, in wisconsin and in iowa. more than you see he's not really in north carolina, for instance. and i think he goes down to florida once, but he's spending every day he's in ohio, but he's also got multiple trips to wisconsin and iowa and in colorado, nevada, places where he feels like they need to have that firewall where even if romney wins ohio, if the president can hold those states and keep romney from picking one of those off, which he'd still have to do even if he won ohio, they can still win the election. he's camping out in those places and spending more time there than down in florida or in virginia or a couple other of the really big states where there are a lot of electoral votes in the south. >> no doubt that the two candidates are the big pieces. other things to watch tonight and through the weekend, first lady, michelle obama, joe biden,
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also big ohio presence this weekend. president clinton on the democratic side doing a lot of campaigning. and tonight in ohio near cincinnati, romney, ryan, their families, and all their major surrogates, minus chris christie are going to be doing a big rally, john mccain, marco rubio, rob portman, one big rally in ohio and then spreading out. that's going to be a big event. and major surrogate action on both sides, nobody believing anything, as we like to say, on the field. >> and very interesting last thing about romney, two stops in new hampshire within the last three days, which is kind of fascinating given -- i mean, he's closing his campaign in new hampshire, but he's also going there on saturday. interesting that they think that those, what, five or four electoral votes could be really important for them. >> one other big piece of news this morning, president obama picked up the endorsement yesterday of new york city mayor michael bloomberg, citing superstorm sandy. the independent mayor wrote an op-ed for bloomberg.com saying he'll vote for the president because of his record on climate
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change. and it reads in part this. "the devastation that hurricane sandy brought to new york city and much of the northeast brought the stakes of tuesday's presidential election into sharp relief. one sees climate change as an urgent problem that threatens our planet. one does not. i want our president to place scientific evidence and risk management above electoral politics." again mayor bloomberg on the edge of issues that really affect this country that people don't take seriously and then they find out too late. an endorsement, of course, from mayor michael bloomberg for president obama. that's great, right? >> it is a fine endorsement. jon meacham, you're an historian. have you heard of an endorsement of a candidate that goes on to read this way? if the 1994 or 2003 version of mitt romney were running for president, i may well have voted for him. because like so many other independents, i have found the past four years to be, in a word, disappointing. >> wait.
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>> so i don't know that there's going to be a big photo op or a big appointment in the offing. but that's the bloomberg brand. >> that's kind of why we love him. >> it's why having $25 billion is, you know -- >> liberating. >> a sense of self-confidence. he's matured in office. he's evolved, as we say. you know, he's picked theories of national and international issues, whether it's guns or climate change he's been working on for a long time. and it's a classic bloomberg thing. i think it's safe to say that mayor bloomberg believes in his heart of hearts that the best possible president would be mayor bloomberg. but that is not going to happen. >> no. >> and so he does take this data-driven analysis. remember, the bloomberg business is built on data. and so i think you put all the factors into a blender and came out for the president. >> an endorsement is an
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endorsement, i guess. >> the great question is whether endorsements matter at all. >> at this point, yeah, it's so interesting. it's very hard to tell what's going to happen. coming up, host of "the last word," lawrence o'donnell, nbc news political director chuck todd, david gregory and leigh gallagher and eugene robinson. up next, mike allen with a look at the "politico playbook." first here's bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> good friday morning, mika. a little more interesting on election day and then wednesday. let me get through the quiet stuff first. we're still watching the effects of sandy bringing down that cold, chilly air all through the eastern half of the country. 40s once again for those areas that were affected by sandy and very cold by buffalo and pittsburgh, only in the 30s. it will warm up a little. we haven't had a lot of sunshine in those areas affected by sandy either. it would be nice to get a couple breaks but don't count on it. mostly cloudy, temperatures in the 50s. your friday forecast, warm in the southern half of the country, chilly to the north.
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as we go through the weekend, once again, as i said, a very quiet weekend. temperatures in the southern half of the weekend, very enjoyable. but we will add a few showers down there, san antonio and new orleans. let's get to the interesting stuff. the election day forecast. we are looking for a chance of a storm to be developing through the southern -- southeastern portion of the country. and that should move up the coast. so rain possibly in areas of georgia, south carolina, north florida, maybe virginia, very late in the day. and then as we go into wednesday, that's when things get a little more interesting. we have the potential for this to be a little mini-nor'easter. it's not a lot of cold air. i don't expect snow to be a problem, but i do have concerns if this storm moves as expected for battering waves, loose tree limbs and the progress being delayed to restore power. so again, wednesday of next week, we could have to deal with some effects from what would typically be a minor storm. because there's no dunes on the beach and whatever damage is just sitting there exposed, we could get those waves coming in in areas that we don't really need it, more beach erosion and
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possibly more wave damage. again, that's wednesday next week. otherwise your weekend forecast looks great. i tell you what, i walked home to brooklyn yesterday, and it was a nightmare with people waiting for the buses. and all of these millions of people that live in this borough are trying to get to work. no subways available. they have to take the bus. good luck. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.
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27 past the hour. "the morning papers." "the wall street journal." the cia was secretly responsible for u.s. efforts in benghazi. in fact, two of the four american personnel were working for the cia as contractors. but congressional investigators say the cia and state department weren't on the same page about which agency was responsible when it came to security.
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"the journal" also reports at one point during the attacks, secretary of state hillary clinton telephoned the cia director directly to seek assistance. >> from our parade of papers, "the seattle times." as the election reaches its apex, president george w. bush not out campaigning for mitt romney. but rather speaking at an investment conference in the cayman islands. organizers declined comment. tickets, $4,000 apiece. >> oh, my goodness. >> sir richard branson said to be there as well. >> there you go. "the charleston daily mail." west virginia still feeling impacts of sandy in the form of snow. in some counties, 80% of residents have no power. and in places three feet of snow cover the ground. this must be just unbelievable. forest crews and fema have been working around the clock with chain saws to carve up fallen trees but more are falling under wet, heavy snow. >> "the washington post," the ipad mini goes on sale. apple expects to sell 1 million
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this weekend. put that in perspective, apple sold 5 million units of the iphone 5 in september. almost two inches smaller than the full-size version, but 330 bucks more expensive than competitors' model. >> 200 in the first day just to halperin. >> halperin. he hoards apple products. he's a hoarder. >> you never know. >> mika, we should point out one thing. we were talking about the marathon before. >> yeah. >> they are donating at least $1 million to the red cross and the mayor's fund. ing is going to donate $500,000 to the recovery, another private group. $1 million. >> keep it coming. make it a no-brainer. if there's a controversy about whether this should happen, those companies, double down, add in. >> triple down. >> more companies join in, make money for hurricane relief. >> amen. >> then there's no question, i think. >> jack up the donations. >> jack it up. >> this is one of those times that writing a check really helps. >> really helps. and there are those who can.
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let's go to "politico." >> mike allen, the chief correspondent for "politico" with a look at the "playbook." good morning. >> and happy friday. >> it is. you're looking at who's winning the ground and the air games in the swing states. what is the air game? >> willie, this is fascinating. these are some statistics that were calculated for "politico" and "morning joe" by "c mag" which captures and counts every tv ad in the country. we've known for a long time that the obama campaign was putting more resources into the ground war. partly because they had two years, four years to build their ground war. and romney had a very short time after the primaries. but in every single swing state, the obama campaign has two, three times the number of offices in the states to deploy volunteers that romney has. but a very underreported and underappreciated phenomenon that's going on in these battleground states is that the obama campaign also has air
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superiority. we so often look at what's being spent. but if you're sitting in your living room, if you're a swing voter, what's being spent doesn't really matter to you. it's what you're seeing. and c-mac calculated that in the last week in these battleground states, the obama campaign had more than twice as many spots on the air as the romney campaign did. so for every obama campaign ad that you see in ohio or virginia, you're going to see half as many romney ads. 17,000 romney ads to 36,000 obama ads. even if you count in all the outside groups that are spending, there were still 15,000 more ads with the democratic message. another thing we calculated, positive/negative. mitt romney ads, 99% negative in these battleground states. the 1%, there were a couple spanish language ads, and there was a little bit of that ad that
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should women working in his cabinet, obama ads, not that much different, 85% negative in these battlegrounds. >> so mike, you said even with the third-party ads, the democratic message anyway comes out on top? because conventional wisdom has been that conservative groups would dominate third-party ads. >> yeah. by number of ads, were 15,000 more republican -- if you count republican versus democrat, 15,000 more democrat ads. and it's partly because of the smart media buying by the obama campaign. they bought early reserve time. they paid much less for their ads. the romney campaign, because of their approach to media buying, which they do in-house as opposed to contracting out, they spent a lot more per spot. they say that that allows them to target their ads much more specifically. but obama's done a lot more broader buying. the obama campaign does tons of buying on cable targeting people
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watching a sports station, watching a hunting station. the romney campaign has focused mostly on broadcast tv. very little cable. >> john, as you know for months now, david axelrod and the obama campaign painting themselves as the underdog because of third-party money, but based on ads, it sounds like for the president and democrats have done better. >> yes, that's true, number one. number two, part of it's because the obama campaign really -- i mean, they came up with fund-raising numbers es speshly in the past couple months that have been off the charts and extraordinary. i want to ask mike, though, you guys reported on this issue before in "politico," the question of the different media-buying philosophies of the two campaigns. i'm a rudimentary student, i'm sure you understand the whole thing better than i do. it seems to me listening to the way you're talking about it now and the way you guys reported it before, it seems to me like the implication, the strong implication is that the obama campaign is just way better at this and that the romney campaign has an alternative theory. but i don't understand what the
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virtues of that theory are. am i missing something? are there two equally valid theories or just the fact that democrats are doing this much better? >> we'll find out on tuesday. the romney campaign says that by paying more, they can pick exactly where they want their spot to go, and it's more laser targeted. but the volume is extraordinary. we calculate how much the obama campaign pays per spot versus how much the romney campaign pays per ad, it looks on paper like the obama campaign has found yet another way to eat the romney campaign's lunch. we'll see if they're doing something that we're not picking up on. but the sheer numbers certainly benefit democrats and president obama. >> we'll know in four days. mike allen, thanks so much, mike. we'll talk to you. >> thank you, mike. >> a quick p.s. on the mayor bloomberg endorsement. we found out that the person who
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delivered that endorsement, the person who made the ad and made it happen yesterday, vice president biden. he's been courting mayor bloomberg, and he got the job done yesterday morning in a call from davenport, iowa. >> joe biden. >> he closed the deal. >> closing the deal. >> a complicated one. >> literally. >> closing the deal. >> all right. >> just a note, on election day, by the way, "morning joe" will be live from democracy plaza, 30 rock. >> not just for a few minutes. >> did you agree to, mika? >> yeah. >> on the wear from 6:00 a.m. till noon, special extended coverage. >> let's do 6 1/2 hours. >> we'll be out on democracy plaza. if you're in new york, come on by. 6 1/2 hours. still ahead, richard engel takes to the skies above new york city to take a look at the damage from sandy. those stories and those pictures next on "morning joe." ♪
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live pictures at 6:39 in the morning of new york city, still dark downtown. as we mentioned earlier in the show, slowly, yes, slowly, more and more of new york's infrastructure coming online. subways and trains getting
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going. buses and planes as well. but for many the reality is a much longer wait as millions of gallons of water are pumped out. nbc's richard engel reports. >> reporter: from here you can see the skyline, that iconic image. new york city surrounded by water. and now partly under water. the pumps. you see the pumps. we were down in that subway. at the tip of manhattan, the south ferry subway station is simply out of commission. from where we are at the top of this water, the top of the flooding to the very bottom, how deep is this pool? >> i would say we have about 20 feet to get there. >> reporter: there is a plan to get the water out. so you're sending a train that also pumps water into the tunnel, into the underwater tunnel. >> we'll bring it in, submerge it slightly. it will have a hose and we'll begin suck being the watsucking water up. >> reporter: the tunnel now
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holds 40 million gallons of water that must be removed with care. >> some places we could probably pump out quicker, but we don't want to collapse the tunnel. so we have to pump it out somewhat slow so pressure is equalized so the tunnel doesn't collapse. >> reporter: even the dock on liberty island has been washed away. the statue just recently renovated and nearby ellis island are now closed until further notice. blame it on a freak storm, climate change, or both. these are problems new york has never had before. >> we see one possible configuration. >> reporter: some say they could be prevented from happening again by building seawalls, levees or gigantic surge barriers. oce oceanography professor bowman. >> there would have been no damage at all. >> reporter: others including mayor michael bloomberg don't see that happening. >> i don't know that i think there's any practical ways to build barriers in the oceans, when you have an enormous harbor
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like we do. >> reporter: the questions and the cleanup continue. the perspective you get from up here is that this is going to take weeks, maybe months. >> it's not over yet by a long shot. >> okay. it's just staggering. >> richard engel reporting. you were talking about gas lines. this is from our helicopter, wnbc, 46 and 10th, people lined up at 6:42 in the morning, gas canisters in hand. as you said, a lot of taxis can't run anymore. >> i've been reading stories about skirmishes happening at these gas stations. people getting frustrated. the attendants who pump gas, those who still do, having to do it for 20, 30, 40 hours straight. and having to have the police come to shut down the area because tensions are running high. this is going to be a long haul. it's going to be -- it's going to be tough. look at these pictures. and you just wonder, we're going
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to have to keep it together. and it's going to be tough. >> and they're rationing gas in a lot of places by number of gallons and price, depending on where you are. coming up next, we'll get through some of "mika's must-read opinion pages." keep it on "morning joe." the capital one cash rewards card
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welcome back to "morning joe." it's time now for the "must-read opinion pages." we've got one from governor haley barbour. "the washington posts," politics
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has no place in disaster. in part he writes this. i'm surprised to the point of disbelief at the reactions from both right and left that new jersey governor chris christie has said favorable things about the obama administration's efforts in those early days after hurricane sandy. republicans worried that christie saying anything favorable about obama is politically disloyal need to remember that a governor's first responsibility is to his or her state and its people. those in the media looking to determine political winners and losers in this situation should stop. we republicans ought to be proud of public officials who, like christie, are faithful to the job they're elected to do. thank you, haley barbour. thank you, alex, for picking that. >> the governor of mississippi during katrina. >> he would know. and it all stops, right, in time of crisis? >> almost two minds of that. >> why are you of two minds about that? >> on the one hand, haley
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barbour did go through the crucible of katrina and bonded with his state and recognized the importance of federal and state cooperation. on the other hand, the notion that haley barbour's big giant brand not having to think about politics, i'm a little skeptical of. >> more than a little. >> he's one of the most political people in the country. i say that in a neutral or admiring way. we're a week away from the election and it all has implications. you can't ignore that. >> it definitely does. sorry, willie. i'm not going to make a fake media fight here or whatever. but all you have to do is look at the pictures of new jersey. all you have to do is open up a newspaper and read what's happening in new jersey, the deaths and the destruction and the people who are desperate. there is no question that he's got to do what he's got to do. regardless. >> and governor barbour is absolutely right that the first concern -- not just for governor christie, but for all of u.s, bt we're less than a week before
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the election, and there's no question, the president yesterday in his speech did a masterful job of taking advantage of the experience of the storm and coming together with governor christie to talk about his re-election campaign. >> it's the difference between intentions and implications. i mean, you don't have to read governor christie is acting in a political way to, as mark says, see the fact that those images, the governor and president obama with a republican governor working in those ways together have political implications for voters who want to believe that government can work, want to believe that it's possible to cross the aisle. those images are being received in a way for some voters that may affect how they're going to vote. and so you can't avert your eyes from the politics of it. even if you're not casting aspersions on anyone doing something manipulative or machiavellian. >> the point of politics is everything has political implications because politics is about people. and so if you have a large event, it's going to have some implications.
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there is a kind of disconnect, though, i think if the supply and demand problem in that there's now an endless demand for people to have something to say about the storm or anything and a limited supply of things we're saying. and i think -- i was traveling some this week and watching a lot of the shows on this, it did feel as though, okay, here's some human sadness. by the way, almost as if they were completing them as comparable things. i do think that sort of thing turns people off politics altogether. >> what is the implication, if there is one, of the criticism from conservatives of chris christie? are they suggesting that he praise the president for his own political gains? i mean, what is that specifically? to run for president in four years? what are they saying? >> getting re-elected as governor of new jersey. i haven't heard very much of that. i don't think that's a big part, any place you can hear conservative voices, talk radio, twitter, websites. >> or from rush. that's a pretty big voice. >> fair enough. >> yeah.
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but it's not -- it's not something that republicans working for mitt romney or downabout races are thinking about or criticizing him for. still ahead, nbc political director, chuck todd, and moderator of "meet the press," david gregory. and tuesday night as the ballots are being counted, joe and i will be at the 92nd street "y" in upper manhattan for a special roundtable discussion on the election. go to 92y.org, 92y.org for tickets. we'll also have information on our blog. mojo.msnbc.com. that's tuesday night starting at 8:15. hope to see you there. we'll be right back.
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vice president biden, take it away, number ten, good things. >> i'm not saying each early voter gets a free cheeseburger, but i'm not saying they don't either. >> see? not saying they do, not saying they don't. number six. >> if you vote early, you don't have to pay taxes. i'm sorry. i'm being told that's not accurate. >> that's not accurate.
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no. number five. >> single and looking to mingle? >> uh-huh. >> find that special someone in the early voting booth. >> yeah, that's right. number four. >> of course, there's the open bar. >> that's right, the open bar. number three. >> not exercising your right to vote is malarky. it's literally malarky. >> whatever you say. number two. >> early voters will receive a $5 million donation from donald trump. >> wow! wow! now we're talking. and the number one good thing about voting early, ladies and gentlemen -- >> honestly, don't you want this election over with already? >> yes, we do. >> when we come back, host of "the last word," lawrence o'donnell joins us on set. also "washington post" columnist eugene robinson. we'll be right back with much
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more "morning joe." i don't spend money on gasoline. i am probably going to the gas station about once a month. last time i was at a gas station was about...i would say... two months ago. i very rarely put gas in my chevy volt. i go to the gas station such a small amount that i forget how to put gas in my car. [ male announcer ] and it's not just these owners giving the volt high praise. volt received the j.d. power and associates appeal award two years in a row. ♪
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rewards we put right back into our business. this is the only thing we've ever wanted to do and ink helps us do it. make your mark with ink from chase. in moments like this, there are not democratic and republican neighborhoods who have been affected by this storm. they are new jerseyans. we must work together to return
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new jersey to normalcy as quickly as possible. that's what people expect of us now. >> all right. just one of the many scenes in the path of the storm. this is new jersey. and this is a line of cars waiting for gasoline. this is the story of the hour. the chopper shot is panning for miles. for miles. they're waiting for gas, and they've been waiting through the night. there is a real emergency here erupting throughout the area in terms of just not only the power being out, but now gasoline shortages. this story is going to continue and develop. and the stories of hardship and misery will develop and continue for days to come. so we're going to stay on this. welcome back to "morning joe." we have mark halperin and john heilemann still with us. joining the set, the host of msnbc's "the last word," lawrence o'donnell. and in washington, pulitzer prize-winning columnist,
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associate editor of "the washington post" and msnbc political analyst, eugene robinson. thanks for being on board with us. thanks for coming in. i know you've been working around the clock. we are days away from the presidential election, and we're days out from hurricane sandy, one of the worst storms ever to hit this country. the death toll now stands at 94. there are still 4.6 million homes and businesses without power. the new estimate for economic damage, to say nothing of all the property damage, is $50 billion in losses. "the new york times" is reporting the storm could shave half a percentage point off the country's gdp. for most of the northeast, it's a recovery mission with lots of different problems erupting. yesterday in california, military planes were loaded with utility vehicles ready to be shipped into new york. an army of some 50,000 utility workers from across the country and even canada being deployed to the region to help in the massive project to restore power. three navy warships are anchored off the northeast coast to help
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with relief efforts. in new jersey, military trucks are being deployed to operate as polling places on election day. in the hardest-hit communities that rewane without power. so we have, throughout all this, an election to work through. the good news does trickle out, but slowly. today amtrak will begin offering limited service between new york city and boston. and new jersey transit will also start moving today with limited service. the new york subway system continues to make advances, but there are still no trains running below 34th street where half of manhattan remains in the dark. so the millions of new yorkers who depend on subways are now waiting in long lines. and look at these lines. for city buses. it's ridiculous. it's almost not worth it. at some point people need to make decisions and people need to work. for those who drive into new york city, the lines at city bridges stretched for miles yesterday, enough to make you turn around and just stay home
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if you could. in an effort to ease gridlock inside the city, the mayor has ordered all vehicles entering manhattan must have at least three passengers for the rest of the week. now, there are checkpoints set up on the way into manhattan. with cars not meeting that rule, they're turned away. and they're only beginning to make your way into new york, if you're lucky enough to find gas for your car, we'll go back to live pictures, these now out of bloomfield, new jersey, about 80% of new jersey stations are either without power or without fuel. those that do have gas are facing nearly impossible demand. with tensions running high. both new jersey senators are now asking president obama for emergency fuel supplies. the damage in staten island, meanwhile, is only beginning to sink in. residents there are accusing aid organizations of overlooking that borough's devastation. the death toll there has risen to at least 19. nbc's ann curry spoke with some of those affected in the
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storm-battered region. >> every single person on this block lost everything. >> reporter: staten island has had enough. >> we just want everyone to know that we are hurting down here, and we need help immediately. >> reporter: residents here are asking why hasn't more help arrived? >> i think that we're not getting the attention because we are, you know, a working-class neighborhood and kind of just like fend for yourself kind of thing. >> reporter: on the debris-strewn streets of this community where the death toll has risen to at least 19, the fury and frustration played out on live television. >> but you need to come here and help us. we need assistance, please. >> reporter: staten island's borough president called it an absolute disgrace. >> members of the red cross are nowhere to be found. so all the american red cross, all these people making these big salaries, these big salaries should be out there on the front lines. and i am disappointed. >> reporter: the red cross says
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it's sending ten vehicles with food and water. meantime, residents and officials are questioning the city's priorities. >> the city of new york right now is talking about getting water out of the battery tunnel. and preparing for a marathon. we're pulling bodies out of water. you see the disconnect here? >> reporter: today new york city police and fire departments were still going house to house to account for everyone who didn't follow the mandatory evacuation order. can you look me straight in the eye and say that the response was not disproportionate for places that are more wealthy in new york city? >> absolutely not. we brought everybody in. there's been fema task forces that have been assigned here now and assisting us with the searches. >> we are in the community talking to the residents. it's been effective. and we're urging everybody to register with fema. >> i never planned to leave here. i thought i was going to stay here the rest of my life. >> reporter: phyllis didn't lose any members of her family, but she did lose virtually everything else.
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>> i want to go home, but there's no home! i can't go home! that's killing me! it's breaking my heart. i want to go home to my house! >> reporter: at 62 and a grandmother, she is trying to find traces of her life. >> this is the only wedding photograph of my mom. >> reporter: a moment of joy as the water on staten island recedes amid widespread desperation and grief. >> and today secretary of homeland security, janet napolitano and fema's deputy administrator are scheduled to arrive in staten island to tour some of the damage. lawrence, we looked at the pictures of those gas lines. the department of defense is now sending hundreds of thousands of gallons of gas in. it's not just people filling up cars. they're getting gas for generators, to keep the heat on and refrigerators running, and it's getting cold. overnight last night, it dipped down into the 30s in the new york area, and people are living without heat. >> i just spoke with a friend of ours in the hall who lives in new jersey, and her generator is out of fuel.
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so there's no heat in her house. two kids in the house. and the question is how much fuel do we have left in the car? and making very difficult decisions about that. you know, i think -- i'm not sure about this. we're going to have to check the history, but staten island may be getting its very first visit from a cabinet member in history. it is the ignored borough. it is the place that's easy to forget in new york city. you know, it's 1,000 feet from new jersey. and it's five miles by water from manhattan. as staten island is happy to be ignored by new york city most of the time, it's never new york city's problem. it has the lowest crime rate by an order of magnitude compared to the rest of the city. it doesn't have the rest of the city's problems. today it has the city's worst problems. >> if you want to zoom in on staten island and the misery and the devastation there, take a look at this picture. brandon and connor moore. these are two little boys who
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were literally ripped from their mother's arms and washed away. so we look at death tolls. we look at numbers. these are the people. and this is just one of many, many stories that we are looking at that we are just finding out about in many ways as the days after hurricane sandy reveal just the magnitude of this tragedy. this mother, glenda moore, spent the night running around in the streets looking for them. and she couldn't find them. and they finally found them yesterday. i think you might be right, lawrence. >> i think part of the delay on our staten island reaction was literally getting cameras there. it is hard to -- once the disaster struck, it's quadruply hard to get there. it took the camera crews a while to get there. once the camera crews got there,
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that's when people started to realize how bad it was. we weren't getting reports about that prior to it. when you look at the geography of it, it really is part of the new jersey shoreline. and it got a direct perpendicular hit from the storm, which is a very, very rare track. and staten island is a very stable hunk of geology. it's not one of these barrier reef islands. it is -- it is bigger by size than san francisco, washington, d.c., major cities of this country. it's bigger by population than most major cities, bigger population than miami and other places like that. and so this very, very stable community, it doesn't -- you know, they don't have these beach houses on stilts out on the stand. it's not that kind of thing. it's a very stable place. and a lot of the devastation is not right on the shoreline. >> it's also very exposed. >> yes. >> you notice how when you pass
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through there, you know, it's not -- there's no big buildings, right? it's all low-rise. and there's not massive amounts of vegetation. so it's like it's very densely populated, actually. and the thing that's kind of really out there even in good weather, you've got to drive through and, like, wow. it's wide open. you feel very exposed to the elements on staten islands on a good day. on a bad day, that adds up to incredible devastation. >> and people think about new york city and fancy buildings. this is a middle-class, working-class community. >> worth pointing out that the police and firefighters live on sta staten island. >> a good proportion live on staten island. it's a great place. it's a really unique piece of new york. >> it is. gene robinson with us down in washington. you're writing, gene, will hurricane sandy be our wake-up call? you walk to talk through that a little bit? >> yeah. i'm writing about climate
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change. and scientists have been telling us for two decades or more that one of the impacts of climate change is going to be to make the weather less predictable, more volatile, and we're going to see storms of the size we haven't seen before and in places we haven't seen before. some years will be fewer and some years it will be more, but it makes the weather crazy. look at what's happening. you know, i covered hurricane katrina. and i'm seeing scenes this week that i thought i would never see again in my lifetime that i saw in katrina. this is just extraordinary, and it's heartbreaking. and we need to wake up and deal with the fact that the weather is different now. and places like new york are going to need a different level of protection, you know, in rotterdam and in london, they have this huge surge barriers to
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prevent this sort of thing from happening. you can say you don't need it, but guess what, if we have a 100-year storm every five or ten years, it certainly is worth it to avoid this sort of tragedy. >> so lawrence, if i could ask you or guys, chime in, at what point when you look at these gas lines and you look at the effects of this storm that will prolong now for weeks and days to come, we were warned. we knew it was going to be big. were we prepared, and could the implications actually have a potentially j damaging effect for president obama? >> i don't think there's time for reaction to turn against president obama, but what chris christie knows, and it's part of his embrace of the president and what mike bloomberg knows which is part of his embrace of the president is they need fast action. you're seeing quite reasonable
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objection now break out on staten island. and i would say it was an exercise of patience for them to wait until yesterday to begin complaining. all politicians know that the very next stage of this for them politically is complaint, is, hey, it's been seven days. or it has been ten days or whatever it is. and they need to -- they need to be seen as being devoted 24/7. >> lawrence, what i'm talking about, it's not just people without internet and without television. this is actually -- >> people with trees in their living rooms. >> life-threatening -- we have two major hospitals in new york city that are nonfunctional. that were supposed to be prepared for this that had generators that failed. we've had hundreds of patients moved out of the city. where are people going to go for medical care? >> they don't have the answers to that. especially on staten island, they don't have the answers to that. >> it's the governor and the mayor need to do more
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symbolically and substantively for staten island today, not just to avoid the political problem. >> it's where the marathon begins. and they're going to have this marathon on sunday on this devastated island. >> gene, jump in. >> i don't see how you can run the marathon. you have this big celebration as they're still looking for bodies on staten island. that's seems crazy to me. and it also seems to me that the situation, they're going to have to start getting people out of there and providing shelter for people as it gets cold and people have been exposed without adequate food and water for several days. and they're going to have a real problem there. so this is a critical day, i think, at this moment on staten island, the jersey shore, places that were really devastated. this is a critical day for action. >> lawrence, i don't know why they don't make every one of those runners a volunteer this weekend. you have all these tens of thousands of people coming to
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new york city, use all those corporate dollars and all those runners and all the people who have descended on the city for a road race and just turn them into volunteers. >> i just don't get how this works. where are the hotel rooms for these runners? the hotel rooms are all packed with people who can afford it, who are dispossessed from their homes already. i don't understand how this is going to work in the city. >> at the same time, i don't understand how they pass up on the relief dollars that it will bring in. >> i understand the dilemma. >> yeah. >> but i just don't quite see how it works out. >> i think willie's suggestion is a very good suggestion. this is an event that has -- going on in some form has symbolic importance in the sense of devastating resilience. let's transform the event into something that shows resilience in a different way and also takes all of those corporate dollars and all of that energy and all of that manpower and makes this a huge symbolic relief thing rather than what it normally symbolizes about the ability of people to test themselves in athletic ways. it just seems like let's have
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this event, but let's have it be a different kind of event. >> we've got bill karins upstairs for us. if you can talk a little bit how the storm hit and how it impacted staten island when it came in on monday. >> a lot of people don't realize, if you drive through staten island, you've gone over the bridges before and you go to the west side of staten island, not many people have traveled on the east side which is where all the beaches are, it's kind of the lower-lying communities. they're all zone "a" people that were asked to evacuate. even a few zone "b" people were hit a lot harder. a lot of talk is should zone "b" have been ordered to evacuate? it was predicted at 11 feet. maybe they didn't evacuate zone "b" because they didn't expect the storm surge to be as high as it was. it was higher than predictions went. so that's one interesting aspect of the dilemma there. and also talking about perceptibility, it's been said, after katrina happened, everyone said, what other vulnerable
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areas area s do we have around this city? we have major cities below ten feet elevation that are susceptible, houston, miami, those are some of the bigger ones south that are used to storms like this. then up the eastern seaboard, everyone threw new york city on that list. nothing happened since 1960 with donna. everybody said it will probably never happen. you look at new york city's climate. in just the last couple years, we had that freak huge snowstorm that shut the city down. i think eight of our biggest ten snowstorms have happened in new york city in the last ten years. and then you're dealing with irene which is a typical scenario last year, so you really can't include that as being exceptional. and then you have this storm which was a big exceptional -- you know, this storm will go down for the area compared to like the long island express hurricane back in the 1930s. you know, we're starting to add to the list, willie. when you get big storms like this, we start to add to the list the number of people who are buying into the climate
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change, and we've got to do something about it. i think that's what the mayor did yesterday. >> as lawrence said, all you have to do is look at the map and see how exposed staten island was. we talk about breezy point and the rockaways. the storm goes left by about a couple of miles, and there's staten island. >> it's all about angle of approach. if you look at the gulf coast, katrina came up like this and piled the water to the north. and because the storm came at us from a very strange direction, east to west, it was almost that same effect where the water piled up. we don't normally get that. that's why it was so much worse than even firefightsome of the for the storm surge. >> this has obviously consumed the country over the last four or five days. we do have a presidential election in four days. beyond the impact of this storm on the race, where do you think we are now four days out? >> in terms of the election, you know, i think the storm has kind of frozen things in place. there is no momentum, if there is any momentum, it's that
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president obama has kind of crept back up into a tie or a slight lead in some of the national polls. you know, i think we are where we have been with a very close race that's going to depend a lot on get-out-the-vote efforts and the ground game. and those swing states that we keep talking about, ohio, ohio, ohio. and now apparently florida's back in play. so, you know, we're on the edge of our seats. >> all right. eugene robinson, thank you once again. your column, of course, is online at washingtonpost.com. lawrence, can you stay with us? >> absolutely. >> that would be great. thank you. when we come back, nbc news political director chuck todd and moderator of "meet the press," david gregory. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.
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after four years as president, you know me by now. you know me. you may not agree with every decision that i make. you may be frustrated at the pace of change. i always remind people that when we did the auto bailout, only 10% of the country approved of it. including, by the way, folks in michigan and ohio. but you know what i believe. you know where i stand. you know i'm willing to make tough decisions even when they're not politically convenient. >> they came up with something this last week, though. the president said he's going to consider putting in place a secretary of business, all right? a department of business. well, first, of course, we already have a department of commerce, and commerce and
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business do mean the same thing, after all. but i don't happen to think that putting in a new chair in the cabinet room is going to bring new jobs to the people of america. so we've got a plan instead to do that. >> welcome back to "morning joe." joining us now from washington, the moderator of "meet the press," david gregory and nbc news chief white house correspondent and political director and host of "the daily rundown," chuck todd. gentlemen, good morning. >> good morning. >> reporter: good morning. >> david, let's start with you. we have been consumed by the storm over the last week or so, but we are less than 96 hours away from polls opening across the country on election day. kind of reset this race for us. where are we right now? >> well, we're still in a very tight race, a very close race as we go into election day with both sides making the case that they have an advantage. there's no question that the president's campaign thinks that some of the optics of sandy dlaish and i don't mean that in a crass political way -- but in a sense of this being a
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big-government moment, the president's growing relationship with chris christie, all of those things gave him the edge of incumbency that he takes into the final days of this race in addition to his ability to compete. and even in those battlegrounds that could slip away to mitt romney. but with the focus on ohio, midwest firewall, that seems to be an advantage right now for the president. but, look, the romney team still believes they're very much in this. this is still a very close race. and i think by all accounts, that's where we are going into election day. i will say this. and chuck and i were just talking about it. i think the crisis level that we're seeing in new york city, in new jersey, in so many parts of the east coast is a really important moment, both because of the desperation in people's lives, the lack of critical resources and transportation needs being unmet here as we get farther away from the storm, this issue of climate change and how government responds to it, this is a critical moment for voters to be thinking about who
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are frustrated at the dysfunction in government that cannot meet critical needs. we face infrastructure needs. we face climate change needs that require government response on the scale of the federal government. and i think it's not just mayor bloomberg, but other people who are looking at this in the final days and saying hey, this has some impact here on how i live and ultimately how i may vote. >> chuck, where are you going to be looking over the next four days? i know you're following the trail of the president and of mitt romney and looking at the map to kind of read into where they're most concerned or where they're most focused. where will you be zeroed in on? >> reporter: look, the schedule is everything. it tells you what they believe in. and when you look at the president's schedule, it's pretty obvious, they believe that -- their whole goal is to get to 272 electoral votes. 71 or 72 depending on how the quote, unquote, midwest firewall holds up, but it really is all about ohio and to a lesser extent wisconsin. they've got colorado. they visit twice. why? it's the wisconsin backup.
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iowa, they visit twice. why? it's their nevada backup and vice versa, if one slips, they want to be able to hold up there. but i'm fascinated by also what romney's done in adding this pennsylvania on sunday. is it a sign of strength, or is it potentially a sign of weakness? is it oh, wait a minute, i'm missing -- is this sort of an on-side kick, hoping you recover it and you've still got to throw the bomb because if you pick off pennsylvania, then you don't have to worry about ohio anymore. and how much of this pennsylvania stop is about that versus a sign of strength? so to me, these candidates' schedules say a lot. the fact that he's spending one less event in ohio and deciding somehow one event in pennsylvania might make a difference, i think it says a lot about where they think ohio is. >> lawrence, if you look at the preponderance of public polls, it matches with what the obama campaign says. small but durable leads. what's the best case if you're the romney campaign from their point of view? say romney can win, what would the public polls and the obama campaign be missing?
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>> just an overall -- what the overall polls, the national polls show, which is a much closer race for romney. and that -- and the old reagan model of hey, it kind of -- it came at the last minute, that there was this last-minute decision heading into the polls that i'm going to make that change. and so i'm not sure there's something -- obviously, they can't point to a track in the battleground polls today that says this, this, this and see how that indicates we're going to win. you know, so i think they're stuck back on that argument of look at how good we're doing, you know, in the overall 50-state polling. we think that's going to have an effect. >> well, and there are two particular pieces to that, right? and i'm going to ask david and chuck to explain this for me. but the interesting things are that right now the national polling shows mitt romney ahead with independents. it's very rare for anybody to win the presidential election
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losing independents. right now president obama is losing independents, not by a little. and the second thing is the notion of conventional wisdom about what happens with undecided voters in an incumbent voters that they tend to break at this point for the challenger. so david, explain to me, and chuck after david explain to me, how those two things can be true. how can it be true that president obama is way behind with independents and also be true if conventional wisdom holds that most undecided voters will break for the challenger, and yet it seems right on the basis of everything that we know that president obama is, in fact, the favorite today? >> right. john, i think it's interesting, one of the things that you hear talking to the obama campaign is where they look at these models of late-breaking undecideds. they also are looking at favorable/unfavorable ratings in some of these battleground states and are seeing, as i think our marist/nbc polls indicated, that in a state, chuck, and correct me if i'm wrong, in iowa where you have mitt romney upside down in his favorable/unfavorable rating. what does that say to the obama campaign? they're going to be able to keep
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pace with these late-breaking undecideds and split them, if not come out ahead. and on the other point, i think it's fundamentally a view of what's the electorate going to look like on election day? because you do talk to romney folks who believe that this wave idea is real, that they see evidence of that in the national polling of vulnerable incumbent president which we know to be true, and despite, you know, overperformance it seems in the polls in a state like ohio that romney can have such an impressive election day. so i think it's really a question of what does the electorate look like? is the obama coalition of african-americans, hispanics, women and younger voters, as sizeable as they expect it to be that it keeps that edge all the way through election day. >> you know, john, the other thing is what's the evidence that undecideds have broken in one direction in a presidential race? basically the only evidence everybody points to is back to 1980. you can't actually find -- i went back and looked at all of
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the polling before 2000 before '04, before '08 and the electoral projections based on all of the polling that we trusted in the good polling we were very careful we didn't just use any old robo poll at the time, same with what we do here, and they were right in line. and it's a proof that the undecided vote, just like in '04, happened again in 2000, happened in '08, and it's likely to happen now, only breaks about 55/45 in favor of one candidate over the other. so there isn't this heavy break. i go back to '80, everybody says it broke in '80. we also didn't have the same amount of data in 1980 that we do today. and that's something that was it breaking or was it slowly moving, and would you have seen it in better shape, i think, when you look back at history, reagan's folks say they saw this building a lot longer than when it happened. the other part of this is, you know, both could be right. remember john kerry four days
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out, first of all, they were making the same argument, hey, this is going to break. and when it breaks, it's all going to break our direction. well, kerry hit all of his turnout targets. but so did bush. and i have a feeling that we're in a situation where both sides are right. there's an enthusiastic republican vote out there that's going to show up in bigger numbers, and there is this durable coalition of voters thanks to census and population growth. and so yes, maybe there's not the same enthusiasm, but because of population growth, the african-american, hispanic numbers are going to be -- are going to sort of make it -- we're going to sort of two giant coalitions colliding, and it's going to lead to this very close race where the field organization's going to be the one-point difference in about five states. >> chuck, in terms of both presidential candidates, what do you think their floor and ceiling is in terms of the national popular vote? >> well, i think that the president is probably, i would say, just under 51% is the
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ceiling. and i'd say 48.5% is the floor. and i think romney has, i'd say, the floor is about the same. 48.5% to 49, but i'd say his ceiling is a little bit higher. >> mark, i know you're hearing the same thing. one of the things the romney people feel about the point about turnout, they have been able to grow since this debate, the pro-romney sentiment as opposed to just an anti-president obama sentiment and that that's going to propel them. i talked to other republicans who are more familiar with the get-out-the-vote operation, that they sense a great deal of enthusiasm. going back to chuck's point, remember high 2004 and how many more democrats came out that year because of a terrific turnout operation in ohio, and it simply wasn't enough because the president, you know, president bush relying on senator rob portman wasn't senator at the time was still turning out his, you know, his base of conservatives in the southern part of the state. so i think what does the vote actually look like? what does the electorate look
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like is going to be critical. >> david, you'll be on the air 48 hours before election day on "meet the press." who do you have on? >> we'll talk to david plouffe but also about the storm from the federal government's point of view with the president just there and what other resources they can provide. we'll also talk to eric cantor about not just the race but governing whoever becomes president as we move forward, and "morning joe" will join us as well. >> we look forward to that sunday on "meet the press." chuck, we'll see you on "the daily rundown." coming up, "parade" magazine has a little advice for the next president, whoever he may be. maggie murphy with a preview of "parade's "parade's" election issue. more "morning joe" when we kpom back.
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we've been showing you these pictures all morning. now the sun's starting to come up. that's ridgefield, new jersey. cars lined up for miles at gas stations across this area in new york, new jersey. a shortage of functioning pumps setting up for another nightmare day for commuters. the weather channel's stephanie abrams is in ridgefield, new jersey, which is about 9 1/2 miles northeast where we're sitting just across the river from new york city. stephanie, good morning. what's the scene there? >> reporter: well, good morning to you, willie. and right now it is taking some
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people 2 1/2 hours in order to get to the pumps here. now, the good news is is they're not rationing gas here. you can take as much as you want. i've seen people take out those red canisters out of their trunks, and they're filling those up as well as filling their cars up. and they're not price gouging. so that's the good news. i walked over to the pump. i saw that it was $3.59 for regular and then $3.80 for premium. but getting in here is a problem. i can't even tell you, willie, actually how we got in here because i'm scared we'll get in trouble in the way we managed to get in here. tom costello, nbc news correspondent, he walked two miles from a highway and left his car way out there just so he could get in for his shot. >> and, i mean, you mentioned the gas canisters. this isn't just people filling up their cars, stephanie, this is people taking gas home to generators as well. >> reporter: right. because it's cold. our temperatures here in the northeast are currently in the 30s and 40s for a lot of places. we're going to be below average
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the next couple of days with highs -- highs only in the low 50s, willie. so people want that heat in their homes. and so they are trying to get the gas for their generators and, of course, the big problem is some gas stations have gas but don't have power to pump it out. but they seem to be moving in a very orderly fashion. there's police here. and as you can see, everyone's calm. and they are just patiently waiting in line. >> i was going to say, from a distance anyway, it looks like a pretty civil scene there. we saw some pictures yesterday of other gas stations, frustration breaking out, people who have been waiting for 2 1/2 hours. >> reporter: yeah. >> you can understand why. >> reporter: i can understand that. when we were trying to get in, you couldn't -- we couldn't navigate past the crowds. and people thought we were trying to cut the line. i got out of the car and i said, i'm so sorry, we're not trying to cut you. we're not trying to get gas. i'm just trying to get to my live shot. but they were getting very frustrated. but when you're waiting 2 1/2 hours, you can see why. >> stephanie abrams of the
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weather channel in ridgefield, new jersey, keeping an eye on it. thanks, stephanie. the october jobs report due out in less than an hour. economist steve rattner and lee gallagher join us to break down the numbers. up next, what do voters want from the next president? "parade's" maggie murphy is here with some advice next on "morning joe." [ male announcer ] you are a business pro.
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>> did your other cover fall through? that's not a gag cover. make it clear, that's a real cover. >> oh, wow! i did not know that was happening. i didn't know that made the cut. okay. >> nice glasses there. >> it was a joke. all right. so listen, this is actually -- no, the cover, thank you. but it's an amazing issue. >> thank you. >> you have amazing writers. you got people from all walks of thought and ideals writing here. david gergen, t. boone pickens, thomas friedman, alan mulally, jeffrey canada, david walker, zeke emanuel, all with different ideas for the next administration, whoever it may be. >> exactly. the premise was a version of "morning joe," which was to put forth the ideas that americans should be thinking about on the sunday before election because they probably most know who they're going to vote for. what should that next president
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do? we reached out, everybody was great. there's some great insights into a lot of our issues. and what you realize when you read it is now interconnected they are. and hopefully americans will sit there and say yeah, we've got to solve the infrastructure problem. we have to solve the debt problem. we have to solve the education problem. as we solve each of these in some small way, we can probably actually help the bigger concern. >> given the times we're in right now, does anybody, obviously this was all written in the days leading up to the hurricane, does anybody in there mention climate change? >> you know, they don't specifically mention climate change. they mention energy independence which i think a lot of people would love to have right now given they're waiting in line for gas on the new jersey turnpike. and ed rendell mentions levees and dams and the need to build and fix infrastructure. and i think that, you know, that's also what governor cuomo said. we need to build things differently, smarter and better than we did before. >> you've got your idea of families which i love and i think some people might say, well, who cares about families
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getting together, but explain your idea. >> getting together at dinner and talking? >> yeah. >> sometimes it doesn't turn out so well. but that was the point. >> if mitt romney wins, he's going to have to deal with harry reid. >> exactly. >> their relationship ain't great. >> no. >> so you think they could have dinner? >> absolutely. in fact, i think the moral of the story in my family is anyone can have dinner together. absolutely. and love each other in the end and all realize we're all in this together. >> what was really great at the end of the last debate, you saw these families who have been opposing each other on stage, chatting, talking, and you realize -- and i think that's the point of your piece and what joe said as well -- you have to become obsessed with befriending your opposition and understand why and find common ground. and i think that hopefully a lot of americans will read this and be motivated as well to find common ground with their neighbors. >> me, too.
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>> you have david gergen doing something counterintuitive. five reasons to stay positive. >> that's a good one. >> you know, gergen basically said he feels the natural gas situation will resolve itself, but we have great, great workers in the veterans coming home that we should be focused on. you know, he has given this speech and found people came up to him and said, thank you for giving us a reason to look forward. and in very bite-sized notions, he really delivers some ideas that sort of basically -- it's not all bad news, though it is today right now. >> lawrence? >> what was that thing you just pointed to? >> what are you up to there? >> also in "parade" magazine, life lessons you can learn from your pet. >> there are life lessons. we have to get advertising from somewhere, lawrence. >> i know. >> i believe that's called web traffic. >> you know, i think hopefully americans will feel somewhat optimistic by this and they'll also feel engaged in the ideas. and i also think everybody
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should invite everybody over for dinner, as mika said. maybe we'll all come to your house. >> month problno no problem. >> do you have any sense of the partisan split of your readership? >> i think we reach 30 million americans, 60 million total leadership. i think we're -- >> everybody. >> you know, we're the dividing line. i think joe says that, too. it is the election. i think there are a lot of people who are going to look at this and say there are too many republicans, too many democrats. i think we want them to look past it and just look at the ideas. and we reach everybody and i think as we all know we all have to keep talking to each other. >> so you've got, let's go through some of the thinkers that you have in this issue. mark mckinnon on fixing government he says pass no budget no pay legislation and the ending of the use of fill busters. enact a five-day week schedule.
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allow no pledges but the oath of office. then you hear from the ceo of ford on creating jobs. there has to be an emphasis on manufacturing with a big "m." no great country has flourished without a strong manufacturing base depending how you measure 2% to 15% of gdp is associated with u.s. manufacturing alone. we need to ask questions like whether we're doing the right things for research & development, it is about looking at everything through the lens by economic development led by business because that is the source of wealth creation. >> there is your business. >> we'll need ceos and the president if he is re-elected has to make a second pass at getting business people to engage and be enthused first dealing with the fiscal cliff but then moving on to things like manufacturing, energy, all of the things that are challenges we face. partisanship for the last year really has prevailed over getting things done. >> the no budget no pay idea has a little flaw in it. the last time i looked and it's
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actually been several years the united states crossed into majority millionaire sometime in the early 1990s. majority millionaires more than 51 millionaires none of whom live off a salary we're not talking about guys who just edged over a million. >> no. >> thank you very much for coming in early this morning as well. and the new issue of "parade" magazine. hey, mr. president. wow. >> i can't believe it. >> thank you. >> beautiful for framing. >> get her own frame. >> okay. thank you very much. we'll be watching "the last word" tonight. >> a special friday edition prelex. i believe it's the final president show. >> great, lawrence. we'll be watching. thank you very much. coming up we'll get the last monthly unemployment report before election day. big numbers coming in. we'll bring in our panel of
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economic analysts to break it down. keep it right here on "morning joe."
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okay. tuesday night as the ballots are being counted joe and i will be at the 92nd street y in upper manhattan for a special round table electidiscussion about th
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elects. tickets are available at 92 y.org. joe is actual i taking care of his mom but i just got word he will be back for his appearance on "meet the press" on sunday and back on the show on monday as well. we look forward to seeing anyone who would like to join us at the 92nd street y in new york city for election night. that'll be fun. up next is staten island the forgotten burough in the wake of sandy? new questions emerging about how new york city is dealing with the response particularly there. keep it right here on "morning joe."
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my mom used to have an expression out of something bad something good will come. i want to tell you what makes me so proud. in moments of crisis democrats and republicans always came together. i got to tell you it was reassuring to be on those calls. i really mean this. it was reassuring. that's how it's supposed to work. we always work better in america when we work together and everyone is in on the deal. >> good morning. it's 8:00 on the east coast. 5:00 a.m. on the west coast as you take live look at new york city. back with us onset we have mark halperin and our guests. this morning we are four days from the presidential election and four days removed from hurricane sandy one of the worst storms ever to hit this country.
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the death toll now stands at 94. 6.4 million homes and businesses are without power. the estimate of damage is $50 billion. the "new york times" reporting the storm could shave half a percentage point off the gdp. for most of the northeast it is now a recovery mission. yesterday in california military planes were loaded with utility vehicles ready to be shipped to new york. an army of some 50,000 utility workers from across the country, even canada, being deployed to the region to help in the massive project and restore power which will take weeks. three navy war ships are anchored off the northeast coast to help with the relief effort. in new jersey military trucks are being deployed to operate as polling places on election day in the hardest hit communities still remain without power. now the good news does trickle out slowly. today amtrak will begin offering limited service between new york city and boston and new jersey
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transit will also start moving today with limited service. the new york subway system continues to make advances. the m train linking queens to manhattan just started running but there are still no trains running below 34th street where half of manhattan remains in the dark. the millions of new yorkers who depend on subways are now waiting in those long lines for buses. for those who drive into new york city the lines at city bridges stretched for miles yesterday enough to make you turn around and just stay home. it is simply not worth it. it'll take all day to get in in some cases. in an effort to ease gridlock inside the city the mayor has ordered all vehicles entering manhattan to have at least three passengers for the rest of the week. there are check points set up on the way into manhattan with cars not meeting three person rules. those cars turned away. you're only beginning to make your way into new york if you're lucky enough to find gas for your cars. about 80% of new jersey stations
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are either without power or without fuel. those that do have gas are facing nearly impossible demand. both new jersey senators are now asking president obama for emergency fuel supplies. throughout the city this morning the cabbies are getting gas at their sub stations and at some point those are going to run out. there is just no gas. no one can get gas for their cars. >> amazing scenes, too, of new yorkers, people in new jersey, connecticut, all up and down the coast look forgue basic human needs, trying to find food, even as close as staten island. food, gas. this is a crisis that seems to be deepening in many ways. >> you know, it reminded me watching the damages of how we talked about how we were going to be prepared for any eventualitiy after september 11 and the drama and trauma of that
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moment and yet how we're beyond first world in so many ways. i'm not sure what you call it that we tend to end up flailing a bit almost disproportionately. >> there were cities and towns that weren't infrastructurally prepared at all and people who didn't heed evacuation orders and now they are in a worse situation than they could ever have imagined in their life times. the secretary of homeland security janet napolitano and fema's deputy administrator scheduled to arrive in staten island, a new york city borough where 19 people died because of the storm. many residents there are feeling desperate. they're feeling overlooked and getting angry saying they have received little emergency aid. nbc's ann curry spent the day there yesterday. >> every single person on this block lost everything. >> reporter: staten island has had enough. >> we just everyone to know that we are hurting down here and we
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need help immediately. >> reporter: residents are asking, why hasn't more help arrived? >> i think that we're not getting the attention because we are working class neighborhood and kind of just like fend for yourself kind of thing. >> reporter: on the streets of this community where the death toll has risen to at least 19 the fury and frustration played out on live television. >> they need to come here and help us. we need assistance. please. >> reporter: staten island's burough president calls it an absolute disgrace. >> nowhere to be found. the american red cross, all these people making these big salaries, should be out there on the front lines and i am disappointed. >> reporter: the red cross is sending ten vehicles with food and water. residents and officials are questioning the city's priorities. >> the city of new york is talking about getting water out of the battery tunnel and preparing for a marathon.
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we're pulling bodies out of water. do you see the disconnect here? >> reporter: today new york city police and fire departments were still going house to house to account for everyone who didn't follow the mandatory evacuation order. can you look me straight in the eye and say that the response was not disproportionate for places that were more wealthy in new york? >> absolutely not. we brought everybody in. there have been fema task forces assigned here and, you know, assisting us with the searches. >> we are in the community talking to the residents who have been affected and we're urging everybody to register with fema. >> i never plan to leave here. i chose to stay here the rest of my life. >> reporter: fiphyllis didn't le members of her family but lost virtually everything else. >> i want to go home but there is no home. i can't go home and that's killing me. it's breaking my heart. i want to go home to my house. >> reporter: at 62 and a grandmother she is trying to find traces of her life. >> this is the only wedding
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photograph of my mom. >> reporter: a moment of joy as the water on staten island recedes amid widespread desperation and grief. incredible stories still unfolding right now. this is what bill karins was talking about yesterday after the sort of novelty of the first couple of days and everyone coming together wears off. the people who are hurting, it's rough. it's going to be a long time for them. >> i also think a lot of cases some of these areas were evacuation zones. people have become jaded. they feel like there is some crying of wolf during natural disasters and they say, this is my home. i don't have anywhere else to go. i'm going to stay put. in a lot of cases on staten island, in fact, 19 cases it cost people their lives. >> you remember back when katrina shall the same thing happened. a lot of residents in new orleans had seen a lot of hurricanes before and heard, this is going to be the storm of the century. nothing ever happened and they ignored the evacuation orders.
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look, you can't -- there is only so much preparation you can do. you can never create a risk free society. you can't prepare for everything. but one of the things that have to happen in these situations for things to work right is for the government has a part to play and individuals have a part to play, too. it has to be working together. when people -- some of these people obviously their pain is genuine and totally understandable, but some of these people, you know, were told to leave and didn't leave. and you understand why they didn't. it makes sense in human terms. but, you know, there is a responsibility that you have for yourself in addition to what the government obviously has for you and yet if you're not -- if both sides aren't working together that's where things fall apart. >> i thought the gentleman who made the point about the marathon happening in new york city while they're digging up bodies and still trying to piece together lives is a great point, but bigger picture the economy has to keep going and there is potentially some sort of symbolism to it as well so i think they're grappling with
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that as well in other towns and communities up and down the east coast are probably dealing with similar decisions as they try and move on. >> it's a complicated calculus because at what point do you show you're strong and resilient and moving forward? we're reminded of the debate after the attacks 11 years ago. there was this kind of tension. i'm not sure what i would do. i understand both. >> i think they really need to make sure, particularly staten island, not just staten island, but that they're doing everything they can for these people before they have this big display over the weekend of law enforcement and all sorts of resources to put this thing on. if there was a symbolic action, there is a huge amount of corporate money that goes into the sponsorship of the marathon. if they were to cancel the marathon and all the corporations put that money into
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disaster relief and we're all going to pull together in a symbolic way. >> i love it. >> make a different kind of statement. you can transfer the resilience of the marathon toward aid and relief. >> how about the corporations settling down and throwing a lot more money into it for disaster relief. >> great. >> making the marathon everything about rebuilding and by the way showing that corporations can be incredible parts of the community and to work with, you know, alongside the government in helping build this country. it would be an opportunity. >> and it is a marathon and the rebuilding effort is going to be a marathon. there could be a nice symbolic gesture. >> my dad was asking the question last night saying where are the -- those guys who make the big bonuses and big companies. where is the moral component? where are they? where are people stepping up? he doesn't feel like he's seeing that. >> they are. i think they are privately. >> there are major companies. there is the red cross and people giving to the red cross. >> a lot of those firms are giving money.
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and for the marathon i think they will give a lot of that money away, the money, the tv rights and all of that will be given to charity but if you stop for a minute and try to imagine the visual of a pack of people jogging through these scenes in staten island or lower manhattan it's going to be very difficult. >> all of these cops and rescue people. there's just a lot of public infrastructure and resources that get diverted to making that route work. >> yes. >> you also realize, again, just how important great political leadership can be right now. >> yeah. >> and governor christie, whatever you think about the national implications, what governor christie has done, what mayor guiliani did, you know, what did not happen in katrina it is such a huge difference to have someone that you feel as if they're actually in charge. >> by the way, tonight at 8:00 we put this together very quickly. it'll be on nbc 8:00 eastern 7:00 central benefits to raise a
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bunch of money for the people who need help through the bruce springsteen bon jovi, the biggest stars to come out of new jersey and new york, all of the money is going to the american red cross. matt lauer hosts. brian williams will be there, jimmy fallon, i think sting. it is going to be a big collection. christina aguilera as well. 8:00 tonight on nbc. >> wonderful. let's go to the presidential elections now. just four days to go. president obama is focusing on, where else, where do you think he went? ohio. he's making stops there every day between now and tuesday. he'll also be in virginia, florida, new hampshire, iowa, colorado, and wisconsin over the next 96 hours. mitt romney will be in many of those same states over the next four days although he is hitting pennsylvania and skipping florida. president obama was back on the trail yesterday after a three-day break to oversee the storm recovery rallying to a crowd of 10,000 in colorado. the president made what some are saying was a stab at his opponent's tendency to change
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his mind. >> after four years as president, you know me by now. you know me. you may not agree with every decision that i've made. you may be frustrated at the pace change. i always remind people that when we did the auto bailout only 10% of the country approved of it. including, by the way, folks in michigan and ohio. but you know what i believe. you know where i stand. you know i'm willing to make tough decisions even when they're not politically convenient. >> mitt romney also returned to prehurricane attack mode yesterday at a rally in virginia. romney blasted the president for suggesting in his interview earlier this week with joe and me that he would consider creating a new secretary of business in a second term. >> i've said i want to consolidate a whole bunch of -- we should have the one secretary
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of business instead of nine different departments that are dealing with i think sba or getting loans or helping companies with exports. there should be a one stop shop. >> they came up with something this last week though. the president said he's going to consider putting in place a secretary of business. all right? a department of business. well, first, of course, we already have a department of commerce and commerce and business do mean the same thing after all. but i don't happen to think that putting in a new chair in the cabinet room is going to bring new jobs to the people of america. we got to plan instead to do that. >> mark halperin let's look at some of the geography here over the last four days. this is president obama's campaign schedule if you can follow those arrows. you don't really need to. look at the states. what does it tell us? >> well, one thing i like to declare a moratorium on -- >> i'm confused by this graphic.
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is that the hurricane? >> yes. >> it's nice. pretty looking. >> the candidate goes someplace on the other side. it shows -- they got to go someplace. >> right. >> they go some places where they're doing well and less well. i mean, it's still about ohio. the winner of ohio is almost certainly going to win this election. you'll see more time in ohio than anywhere else. the president is going to be in ohio today. from virginia to iowa. the weakness is wisconsin, a state they weren't necessarily counting on having to defend but you can't just camp out in one place. we've had a playing field of seven to nine states now maybe ten because you're seeing some republican action in pennsylvania but this is about ohio and they are the focus as much as anywhere else for both of them. >> coming up the last monthly jobs report before the election is due out in just a few minutes. "morning joe" economic analyst
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steve rattner, lee gallagher and cnbc's brian sullivan join us for a full analysis. first, bill karins with a check on the weekend forecast. bill? >> well, mika, the weekend foreca forecast, wednesday it seems to get more interesting. there is another storm coming up the eastern seaboard. this one will pale in comparison. maybe 1/100th of what we just dealt with. regardless the beaches are very vulnerable right now because there are no dunes. we really don't need any wave action coming up the coast. the storm on tuesday election day appears to be in the southeast, gaining a little strength. just rain in georgia, south carolina, north carolina. really shouldn't be too bad. shouldn't affect voting turnout. then by the time we get to wednesday the storm comes off the outer banks heading somewhere just off of cape cod. hopefully over the weekend the storm will transfer further offshore. as of now it looks to have impact in the area hit by sandy, battering waves, some loose
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limbs could fall down from trees with the 40-mile-per-hour wind and just the progress being delayed would be bad enough. that's the idea of what we're watching next week. this morning we're still watching people without power. about 3 million to 4 million in very cold conditions with temperatures in the 40s. again, the weather map over the next three days, find your location. i'll fast forward through it. there are not a lot of issues out there. as we go through the weekend we may see a few showers and storms in texas, arkansas, and tennessee and again there on sunday. no big storms on the map the next three days. all eyes on tuesday and wednesday. once again, for the east coast. we leave you in the shot. they're still recovering around d.c., too. a lot of people have gotten their power back still looking at beautiful fall foliage and hopefully sunshine. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.
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welcome back to "morning joe." it is 22 past the hour and we are about 7 and a half minutes from the monthly jobs report that is going to come out. the last one before the election. we'll be watching for that and covering it live. joining us now we have former treasury official and morning
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analyst steve rattner and also lee gallagher. we'll be getting ready for those. steve, let's start with you. as we look ahead to the jobs numbers what can we expect? we'll start with impact on the economy overall and impact on the election. >> i think the consensus nothing terribly surprising. it is that we'll have something around 125,000 jobs which is roughly what we've been adding over the -- so far this year. the unemployment rating ticked down substantially last month. you'll also remember it is important to know when we get these numbers that the unemployment rate and the number of jobs calculated are two different surveys. the unemployment rate which is a household survey is generally considered more volatile. the jobs number is the one people tend to focus more on. economists won't be surprised if the jobless rate picks up a little given how much it came down last month and expecting 125,000 jobs. if that is what we get we'll defer to my political colleagues
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that is not a job changer it seems to me but the kind of steady state romney will say we're not growing enough jobs and obama will say we are growing jobs. >> lee, what will you be looking for beyond the fact we want them to get better? what are the layers? >> if you drill down it'll be important to see what sectors are growing. there was a really good warmup information yesterday that came out in both the weekly jobs numbers down 9,000 and the adp numbers that steve referenced also really quite strong and that is an indication construction jobs were doing well which ties into what's happening in housing right now. we're seeing a recovery. also interesting, what is really important is to look at wages and hours. the wages have been going down but hours have been going up so overall weekly earnings have been within a range. they haven't moved much but have been slowly climbing in the right direction. >> all right. we're like four and a half minutes away from these numbers coming out. politically how much does anything matter at this point given that we have this
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catastrophe that we're dealing with on the east coast as well? >> i think steve is right. both sides will cherry pick to make a political point. unless it is a giant swing one way or the other i think the general trajectory is that the economy isn't going to be impacted by these numbers. quite different than we speculated once upon a time that this would be a seminole moment in the year in terms of defining the race. >> it may not even resonate with some as they're trying to pick up the pieces of their lives and looking at the big picture. >> i think that's right. if they were dramatic one way or the other you'd have at least the capacity for the candidates to make closing arguments with a little more oomf. >> so then give us a sense when we get the overall number we are always like here is the number and everyone tells us why it doesn't matter or why it does. what are we supposed to be looking for when the number
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comes out? let's say there is a drop or not in terms of reading between the lines. >> well, it's going to be a number, two numbers. the number of new jobs added and the change in the unemployment rate. that'll be the first thing everybody looks at. then they'll start to look at as you say some of the entrails of it all. they'll look at the revisions to the past months. we actually had stronger issues in the past months last month which was another good sign to the economy. lee mentioned incomes which don't get nearly enough tension in the jobs numbers. really what's happened in people's pocket books. we'll start to look at that. they'll also look inside those job numbers as lee was referring to where the jobs are coming from. she mentioned construction. i would also mention one of the things that held down jobs growth has been the contraction of public employment. there are fewer and fewer government workers because of the fiscal crisis and we'll look to see what the balance was there between private sector jobs and public sector jobs. >> i believe steve mentioned one of the drags is the contraction in the public sector.
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what are other things holding back the economy and keeping us from breaking through 2% growth? >> to really change the number you have to be adding 250,000 jobs a month. that is not going to happen until there is natural organic growth in the economy. right now we're seeing businesses cut costs. they've cut them to the bone. that is where a lot of the profits we've seen in the past couple years are coming and why we haven't seen hundreds of thousands of jobs being added. businesses, ceos we've talked to are still very, very conscious right now, and what is going to happen with the fiscal cliff? what is going to happen with the budget? they're waiting to make major decisions and aren't going to hire until it is somewhat resolved. what we're seeing is kind of funny. the first real signs of a genuine recovery i think since ben bernanke first talked about green shoots a few years ago. >> there is a lot going on that is very positive right now including consumer confidence. consumers are feeling better. businesses are not. >> so the dominant thing holding
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us back is resolution of the fiscal cliff. >> i think that is one of the things. we're also facing a major deleveraging of the consumer that's still going on and also the whole economy is in the middle of this very long transformation from, you know, manufacturing base to service base. and that is where you talk about the changes. >> i think lee mentioned incomes and incomes are really important. i was in chicago last weekend and chicago median incomes have dropped well below the national average because of this enormous pressure from globalization on wages. it's a really tough problem that nobody has focused on. >> the monthly jobs report is now minutes away. cnbc's brian sullivan will have the numbers next on "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪
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♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
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here they are. the unemployment report was out seconds ago. the numbers from cnbc's brian sullivan live from cnbc's global headquarters. >> they are better than expected. 179,000 for the month. that is 46,000 more than the estimate or at least some of the estimates. the unemployment rate 7.9% so still under the 8% mark. i think the two better numbers are the fact that there were
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some prior revisions that were revised higher as well, mika. and you've also got the better data on hourly working so basically -- kind of waiting for the government report to actually update on its own website rather than go with the headlines. 171,000, 7.9%, and 184,000 private sector payrolls were created so all in all, guys, a better than expected jobs report and we are seeing stock futures rise on that number. >> literally on the numbers. steve, your take? >> i think brian said it. this was certainly a positive for the president in terms of this continuing, gradual improvement in jobs. i think economists expected as i said earlier that the unemployment rate might well go up a tick because it's been down so much last month and as brian pointed out still under 8%. i think generally the revisions are good. the private sector job creation was even stronger. the loss of government jobs. the only thing i see in this release that is troubling a little bit in the longer term is the incomes are not growing.
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there was no growth in income last month for the average american and that does hinder the recovery. >> all right. lee, stand by. brian sullivan, you have more here. go ahead. >> i'm digging through here. sorry, guys. here are some of the other numbers i see as i dig through it. 813,000 so-called discouraged workers in october which is a lot but here is the good news. that is a decline of 154,000 and the labor force participation rate, the number of people in the market looking for a job actually ticked higher. so signs of confidence. people getting a little more encouraged about their ability to get a job even if they don't have one. that's been one of the sticking points we have seen the last couple months in really years. >> lee gallagher? that is really the most important number here. this is why in a way this number is the best of both worlds. you have this 171,000, a huge number because the estimates were as low as 105 as high as maybe 130. 171 is a huge deal. secondly the number always is going to tick up a little bit as
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brian said what happens. people re-enter the work force. you don't want it to tick up too much or people will start to freak out again. so up 1% which is good and great and so, you know, strong on both counts. >> is it too soon to ask one of you the impact of the hurricane on this? there is talk of it shaving half a percentage point off the gdp. >> it is certainly not going to be a factor economically in the election. the hurricane is a negative. anyone who wants to try to spin it as some kind of positive economic thing because they're going to build a bunch of hurricane barriers is wrong. this is a loss of national wealth, a loss of things that have to be paid for. i think the economists think it is going to cost off the gdp in coming months but won't be a factor in this election. >> normally as you said we're starting to see initial positive reaction. you think markets will stay positive off of this news or will they take a second look as
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sometimes happens and turn a different direction? >> you know, i hate this kind of question. they're impossible to answer. listen, the market is a forward discounting mechanism. it looks ahead. i think the point about what is this going to do over the next month, the hurricane as well. the market theoretically is supposed to be based on stock prices that are future corporate earnings. right now that's all a stock price is is what you're betting on earnings coming in at so i think what the hurricane may do, how retail sales are looking but here is the thing, guys. the reality is this that we have seen, unless this just crushes the storm, crushes confidence, we've seen upticks in retail sales, upticks in consumer confidence, now more confidence in the job market. when people are confident they spend money. i don't know what is going to happen on the market today but it's been a pretty good year so far and people are more confident and that is the american economy is just confidence. >> jon meacham? >> what is the -- the conventional wisdom that an
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obama re-election keeps private sector money out of the economy, that people still believe there is going to be regulatory uncertainty and not going to be invested? you talked about cost cutting. >> i think either one getting elected keeps money on the side until there is some resolution of the fiscal cliff and what the tax policies are going to be and more clarity on regulatory -- probably more questions if reagan -- excuse me -- if romney is president. more questions if romney is president about what the regulatory policy is. with obama we know. the big thing is the overhang of the fiscal cliff. it's going to dominate the news for the next six to eight months. >> it depends what industries we see growing. if you look at what is happening, one fascinating thing about unemployment numbers is they are so hyperregional. you look at north dakota. there is a sale boon. unemployment is 3%. it is 1% in certain places. >> wow. >> then you look at places like nevada and it is close to 12%.
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california is 10.8%. even within california, i was just in silicon valley last week. they cannot find -- the biggest problem is they cannot find engineers. that is the biggest problem. then you go to southern california and it's a different story. >> brian sullivan and lee you were pointing out the uncertainty that ceos feel yet there are companies that are doing well and there is consumer confidence. there is data on the table that shows upticks, that shows people are feeling confident. how is this not in sync then? i mean, i understand that the administration might have caused some uncertainty for major companies but at the same time, at the same level they are making profits are they not? what am i missing? >> well, one of the -- the big thing -- >> i'm sorry. brian, go ahead. >> ladies first. >> all right. lee gallagher? >> i'm sorry, brian. >> please jump in. >> don't worry about it. >> a lot of this is a productivity thing. in the past three years these
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companies have been forced to see what they can get by with. and you've also had this technological improvement. so you've got retailers now using weather software to tell them, maybe this is a bad week to talk about this, but to tell them, you know, when they should really staff up almost to the hour so they don't have to plan, you know, they can plan it much -- they need fewer people basically. that is one example. but i mean the productivity has really had an impact. >> brian sullivan? >> my take is, i don't know if it's better or worse or just whatever. there are two economies right now. the unemployment rate for people that are over 25 that have a four-year college degree is just 3.8%. it went down from 4.1% to 3.8%. that's basically full employment. we have two economies in america right now. if you've got a four-year college degree the numbers say you can probably get a job. it may not be the job you want but you'll probably be employed. if you own a home you refi you
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have more money. right? the stock market is up because the fed is basically throwing all this money into it. so if you've got money and you've got assets, unfortunately, you're probably getting wealthier because of the fed. if you don't have a college degree the unemployment -- if you don't have a high school degree the unemployment rate is 12.2%. so what we're looking at here are people that are working are doing better because the fed has basically made everybody wealthier and lowered our costs. if you don't have a job or high school diploma it's very difficult. i think that is the bifurcated economy. i was in silicon valley last week as well and i saw the same thing. you know, forget engineers. they can't find anybody because nobody can afford to live close enough to silicon valley who is a service worker. you got to live 100 miles away to commute to your job working in a hotel. >> very good point. >> look at the politics of this. on the prism of my twitter feed. journalists are basically saying two things. one is, mostly good news. if you're looking at the merits. plenty of talking points for the president but also some are
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saying no real change, david gregory and others saying both sides have their talking points that are the same as before. the republicans so far have one talking point. >> what is that? >> the unemployment rate now in this report is higher than when the president took office. that is their main talking point. that's not -- they're not seizing on this the way they would have had we seen a less good report. i think that means to me on balance better day for the president than he could possibly have expected or hoped for just a few months ago when things looked a lot worse. >> okay. all right. wow. brian sullivan, thank you very much. >> you're welcome. >> it's been quite an action packed week and a really tough week for millions of families along the east coast. ahead, our look back at the week of hurricane sandy. we'll be right back. everyone loves surprise parties.
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it's a long road ahead for millions of families in new york and new jersey. today morning joe looks back on the week that was hurricane sandy. >> good morning. clear and present danger. sandy swirls along the east coast. >> a halloween super storm strengthening overnight. a once in a generation event. >> the island of manhattan all but shut off. no way in no way out. >> the time for relocation or evacuation is over. >> don't try to be a show off. this is not a time to be stupid. >> it's gotten worse in the last hour or so. >> right here at battery park looking at water sloshing up across the sidewalk.
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finally, hurricane sandy. >> after a night of destruction that hasn't even begun to be assessed. >> terrible. no power, no water, no phone service, no sewage, nothing. >> i've never seen something like this before. >> it was the scariest thing i've ever seen. >> ripped in half, sidewalks are gone. >> water is rushing in. water is going by. you don't know what to do. >> it was unbelievable. i never saw anything like that in my life. >> we don't know where it's going to take us. we don't know. >> there is barely anything left of the second major pier here in seaside heights. >> the subway system that carries 5 million people is flooding. >> at the hudson river, it came over the banks. >> we year sengsly in a blackout in this part of manhattan. there was an explosion at a transformer. >> in hoboken, new jersey where
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the national guard arrived late last night to help evacuate residents. >> the medical center being evacuated. >> moved more than 200 patients and even babies in critical condition. >> i was holding a cell phone, while he was putting in the iv and the epidural. >> these are live pictures. there has been a partial crane collapse. >> the stock exchange is sand bagged. it's closed for the first time since 9/11. >> the breezy point neighborhood of queens looks like a war zone after a fire devastated the small community. >> we've faced these kind of challenges before and as we have it's good to see how americans come together. >> during the darkness of the storm, i think we also saw what
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is right in america. we're going to rebuild but it is going to take some time and some effort and some resilience. >> are you resilient? >> yes. yes. we all are. >> you know, we'll be here for each other, you know, still, and through this. >> we are coming back. definitely. without a doubt we are coming back, all of us. together. ♪ we take care of our own ♪ we take care of our own >> all right. that was great, guys. thanks to our producer and editor for putting that piece together. quite frankly to the entire "morning joe" team. it is exceptional to work with you. a reminder tonight at 8:00 the networks of nbc universal are joining forces to air a one-hour live benefit telethon to raise
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money for hurricane relief hosted by matt lauer. it includes performances by bruce springsteen, billy joel, bon jovi, annd many others. money will be donated to relief efforts for hurricane sandy. we'll be right back. ah. fire bad! just have to fire roast these tomatoes. this is going to give you a head start on your dinner. that seems easier [ female announcer ] new progresso recipe starters. five delicious cooking sauces you combine with fresh ingredients to make amazing home-cooked meals.
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mayor bloomberg is letting only cars with three or more passengers pass the bridges and tunnels into manhattan. normally it's just me and my driver hector. so this morning i had to -- sorry. i'm sorry. this morning instead of going in hector's audi aal with the heated leather seats i had to take the bus. yes. a public bus. with the public in it. i couldn't find the seat warmer.
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i kept pulling on that string to call the stewardess but nobody came. they never even pulled out the drink carts. i felt like beelg mortenson. come on, bloomberg. i know this is a once in a lifetime storm but it's been two days. what's the holdup? how hard is it to drain sea water from 20 miles of subway tunnels? please. on that bus with all of those people. they were everywhere. ♪ somewhere down the road ♪ it's all right ♪ it's all right if you have someone to love ♪
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tuesday night as the ballots are being counted joe and i will be at the 92nd street "y" in upper manhattan for a special round table discussion about the election. jon meacham and steve rathner will be with us. we're working on halperin. tickets are available at 29 y.org and find more information
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on our blog mojo.msnbc.com. that is tuesday night. joe is taking care of his mom. but he will be back for his appearance on "meet the press" on monday, the show on monday and 92nd street y on tuesday night. what have you learned? >> americans will settle in their homes for the final moment of deciding and are highly affected by the parade magazine article. >> i have the "parade" magazine and i learned that mika is a woman of many talents and if this morning joe gig doesn't work out she has other things she can do. >> thanks. great. my parents watch. i thought they'd miss that one. meacham? >> very briefly willie geist if you all want to write him and e-mail him he has become a member of the student media hall of fame. >> no way. >> the student media hall of fame. the "today" show student media